Session 7: Doctrine of the Trinity: Historical Development
Posted by: carrie in Spring 2008Spring 2008 Online Certificate Students:
View all sessions below. Then log all your comments, questions, discussion question answers, criticisms, or thoughts below. Time spent in the comments section will apply toward your one hour of community time per week. To download audio sessions, visit the course homepage on the TTP site. The next session will be posted each Wed.
Note:
This is not the place for general discussion and questions. Go to the foyer for general discussion and refer to the FAQ on the right for question. Time spent in the comments section will apply toward your one hour of community time per week. To download audio sessions, visit the course homepage on the TTP site. The next session will be posted each Wed.
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How can God be one yet thee? Did the early church believe in the doctrine of the Trinity? Was Christ created? The formal doctrine of the Trinity is a hallmark of orthodox Christianity. Like the Christian doctrine of salvation by grace through faith, this doctrine is totally unique to Christianity. Upon completion of the session the student will have struggled with the early Christians as the attempted to articulate what it means that the Father is God, Christ is God, the Holy Spirit is God, yet they all are not the same. The student will come to appreciate great Christians of the past and the ecumenical councils that attempted to defend this doctrine to skeptics. The student will become familiar with the common Trinitarian heresies of the past, understanding how they still affect peoples view of God in the present.
How did the early church understand the Trinity?: Play Now | Play in Popup | Download (36) What are early Trinitarian heresies? Part 1: Play Now | Play in Popup | Download (41) What are early Trinitarian heresies? Part 2: Play Now | Play in Popup | Download (36) What is the importance of the ecumenical councils?: Play Now | Play in Popup | Download (34) What are some of the difficulties in communication the doctrine of the Trinity?: Play Now | Play in Popup | Download (29)
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March 9th, 2008 at 7:53 pm
SPECIAL ANNOUNCEMENT:
Classmates, this is off topic but I would like to let you know that I have prepared a colorful Scripture Memorization Sheet with all the verses printed out that I would like to make available to you. This is in Microsoft Word format. All verses are taken from the NASB with the exception of Romans 9:5, where I took the quotation from the NET. If this might be helpful to you in your memorization work and you’d like a copy, please send me an email at argom3@cox.net and I’ll send you one.
In Christ,
Rick G
March 13th, 2008 at 4:56 pm
TR -Week 7 – Group Discussion Questions;
1. The doctrine of the trinity is what binds us as a church together. Who Jesus is, what His relationship to and with God is, then how we relate to The Trinity, defines who we are as a body.
2. a. I allows a set standard or platform if you will to build our faith and trust upon. When new theological ideas are brought forward, then the doctrine of the trinity is a measurement we can use (or the church fathers) to question the pronounced theology brought forward.
b. Because it spells out the truth, the answers, the understanding of who the Trinity is. Their cults fall apart WITH the doctrine of the trinity.
3. ????
4. I believe that heresies are a great way for God to spell out the wrong way to believe or think of something, so that we can study it, know it’s been proven wrong and not have it printed in His Word. Some would add truth to the heresies if they were in the Bible.
5. Trials and tribulations have always helped me in my learning difficult situations. Hopefully we can learn from past relationships and how we handle life better next time.
6. The water/ice/steam heresy has always been a good example to me of how the Trinity works…. Oh well….
7. I just glad that God blessed me with not having to be born for the 1st 1000 years after Jesus died. I would have been totally lost and confused in all the arguing, fighting and heresies. Amen.
March 13th, 2008 at 7:39 pm
First, this is one of my favorite classes within the program!
1. How important do you believe the Doctrine of the Trinity is for Christianity?
A. It is a convernstonre pice that can’t be “rejected”. Fot the Father had and has and will continue to be in perfect relationship with His Son and His Spirit. he has a personal realtionship with us as well. Now, God is holy (whole) so only His Son could come in the flesh to atone for ours sins and make things right with Him again.
2. Why do you think the Doctrine of the Trinity has been a test for orthodoxy since the beginning of Christianity?
A. Well, the word Trinity is never used in Scripture so it must be a developed doctrine based on God’s word. It sort of makes you think about Him and who He is and I think He did this on purpose.
2b. Why do you think so many cults denty the Doctrine of the Trinity?
A. One God without a Son or a Holy Spirit is just easier to understand. Jesus in the flesh is hard to understand til your read the Matthew 4 Temptations - Christ went thru everything just like us. Cults make up stuff to control people sometimes maybe without even realizing it? The Devil only needs to turn you one degree this way or that to accomplish his worldly purposes.
3. A person once said that the existence of the Doctrine of the Trinity is poof that Chrisitanity is not human in origina, since no man would ever come up with something so confusing. How true is that?
A. This made me smile cause I agree with the statement. Why complicate Tod who is One (Deuteronomy 6 Shema)? What would you have to gain by doing that?
4. We attack a concept; we publicize it; we meet to condemn or approve it and then bakc ut up with facts, creeds to ease understanding for all.
5. Trials shape us. They cause tension and they help us to focus on Him and our need for Him. I love God for my trials now though I didn’t when I was going through them!
6. Modalism: very effective explanation until you see the little jurisprudence weighting system in the workbook (pg 109) that has the 3 weighing more then the One. The idea of one person with three separate roles or offices is appealing and maybe is sensible us humans. I know of two people who struggle with Modalism vs Orthodox Trinity.
7. How was my thinking most challenged by this lesson? Explain.
A. The Trinity is real and we humans probably can’t understand it in total. That was made clear to me by the flow of models from Ebionism to Docetism to Modalism to Arianism, etc. People have a tough time with it but Deuteronomy 29:29 says “”The secret things belong to the LORD our God, but the things that are revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may do all the words of this law.” I love this verse!
March 14th, 2008 at 8:27 pm
Session 7 Discussion Questions
1. How important do you believe the Doctrine of the Trinity is for Christianity?
Without a proper understanding of the Trinity, true Christianity is improbable, if not impossible. All the Scriptures that describe this aspect of the nature of God’s being together portray three persons yet one God. Although paradoxical, these statements must be allowed to say what they mean. Heretical beliefs such as those that deny the Trinity create groups and individuals that become harmful to the witness and mission of the Church.
2. Why do you think that the Doctrine of the Trinity has been a test for orthodoxy since the beginning of Christianity?
When one goes to the extremes of modalism or tritheism the result is the same. God is defined in a way that diminishes Him so that man’s finite minds can better explain His nature. These extremes strike me as being to some extent idolatrous. The reason this doctrine has been a test for orthodoxy is because it reflects the summary teaching of the Bible on this subject.
3. A person once said that the existence of the Doctrine of the Trinity is proof that Christianity is not human in origin, since no man would ever come up with something so confusing? How is this true?
As was mentioned in the lectures, one characteristic of heresies has been a tendency to simplify difficult Biblical concepts in an unscriptural manner. For example, Joseph Smith, the founder of Mormonism once said in a speech that the Trinity equals three Gods. We would like to have easily understandable and acceptable answers to the difficult questions of life. The fact that the doctrine of the Trinity is as challenging as it is suggests a divine origin.
4. Most of the Trinitarian heresies that came about through the history of the Church came from well meaning Christians who were doing their best to understand a difficult concept. Discuss how God uses heresy to shape orthodoxy.
Some of those who produced Trinitarian heresies may have been well meaning Christians; some were not and others it is difficult to determine for sure. It could be that some of these sought to advance their personal agendas rather than God’s. Regardless of the way these beliefs were conceived, these unorthodox teachings spurred the Church to carefully examine and to articulate the implied Biblical concept of the Trinity. When it came to the deity of Christ, Arius’s teachings forced the Church to defend that Jesus was fully God as well as fully man.
5. Difficulties entered the Church to help shape it into what God intended and, without it, the Church could not be what it is today. Difficulties also come into our own lives personally to help us become what God intends. Read 1 Peter 4:12 and James 1:2-4. How does understanding how God works in history help you to understand how God works in your own personal life?
“Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery ordeal among you, which comes upon you for your testing, as though some strange thing were happening to you;” (1 Peter 4:12 NASB)
“Consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials, knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance. And let endurance have its perfect result, so that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.” (James 1:2-4 NASB)
Consider what God has to work with, both with nations and individuals. We are imperfect, fallen and sinful beings and we create imperfect, fallen and sinful societies. When believers face trials, obstacles and opposition, these things can strengthen us spiritually if we view them properly. The best analogy I can think of is physical conditioning. If a person lives a habitually sedentary lifestyle, it take’s a toll on one’s health and ability to deal with physical challenges. The same is true of someone’s spiritual condition. Like it or not, we need opposition.
6. Of the Trinitarian heresies discussed in this lesson, which one do you have the tendency to unwittingly embrace to some degree? Explain.
In my Mormon days, I went with the tritheistic view. Afterwards, when I considered the Trinity, I kind of went to the other extreme. Although I was not really modalistic, for a time I speculated that maybe Father, Son and the Holy Spirit were all “phases” of the same being.
7. How was your thinking challenged the most by this lesson? Explain.
Struggling with the tension (of the idea of three persons in one God) like I never had before was a good mental and spiritual stretching exercise. But like physical exercise there comes a point when you have to say, “good enough” or risk injury. Augustine said that anyone who denies the Trinity is in danger of losing his salvation and that anyone who tries to understand the Trinity is in danger of losing his mind.
March 16th, 2008 at 2:43 pm
Trinitarianism: Session 7
1. I believe the Doctrine of the Trinity is important to orthodoxy. If you don’t believe Jesus is God, then Christianity is a false religion, as we would be placing our faith in a created being. It is the only way to reconcile the Father, Son and Holy Spirit as separate beings, while still maintaining our belief in monotheism. However, because this doctrine is so difficult to comprehend, I can’t be dogmatic about it.
2. I’ve always struggled with this doctrine, so much so that I’ve not considered it to be a true test of Christianity. My thinking was “if it is essential, then God would have made it more understandable to us”. But as I study and grow more I can better understand why it has been a test of orthodoxy. Without the Doctrine of the Trinity, you either believe Jesus did not have a divine nature or that he was divine and there is more than one God. Either one negates Christianity. It is also a test of orthodoxy because it requires a certain amount of faith. It is not blind faith because God has given us enough information that we can have a reasonable understanding. But, it requires faith because of our finite minds and limited ability to understand an infinite God. And the trinity serves as a model for Christians, as we are all separate beings, yet have the ultimate goal of being one in Spirit.
The Doctrine of the Trinity is denied by many cults because it is such a difficult doctrine. As humans we tend to want neat answers and some of the cults have provided that, which alleviates the tension and makes it more palatable.
3. I have never thought about it that way, but it does make sense. A doctrine with a human origin would likely be more understandable to our human minds.
4. Heresy may shape orthodoxy, because it provides an opportunity or need to defend and articulate your beliefs.
5. Adversity and trials have the potential to shape us. It helps to refine you, build character and strength and helps you to become more mature. As much as we hate trials, it does provide an opportunity to grow.
6. I find Arianism the easiest heresy to comprehend. The idea that Christ was created and of similar substance with the Father is very reasonable to my mind.
7. The Doctrine of the Trinity in general is unbelievably challenging. Though I have to say this class has clarified quite a bit. I’m looking forward to the remaining classes.
March 17th, 2008 at 11:13 am
1. How important do you believe the Doctrine of the Trinity is for Christianity?
I believe it is certainly an important doctrine, it is a doctrine that the early church had to deal with and was certainly a significant issue for the early church. That leads me to believe that this is a big issue. Over time, this doctrine has become more and more developed and refined. This gives us a greater understanding and articulation of this remarkable concept. Nonetheless, a person’s view on the Trinity is key to orthodoxy within Christianity.
2. Why do you think that the Doctrine of the Trinity has been a test for orthodoxy since the beginning of Christianity?
Well, I believe the most important reason that it has stood the test for orthodoxy is that it is Biblical. The Bible is our guide for our life and faith. Although the Trinity is not a term used in the Bible, it is an explanation of the concept being presented consistently in the Scriptures.
3. A person once said that the existence of the Doctrine of the Trinity is proof that Christianity is not human in origin, since no man would ever come up with something so confusing? How is this true?
Well, the concept of the Trinity is certainly a mind-blowing concept. It is an amazing reality. I do not know if the Trinity can completely explain the concept. In the later pages of our workbook chapter on the subject, many analogies were put forward to explain how God can be one and in three persons. Although some of the analogies are helpful, they ultimately fail at some point. It just goes to prove how much greater our infinte God is compared to our finite minds.
4. Most of the Trinitarian heresies that came about through the history of the Church came from well meaning Christians who were doing their best to understand a difficult concept. Discuss how God uses heresy to shape orthodoxy.
Challenges to our faith ultimatley have caused the church to respond. These challenges make the church think about our faith, think about our beliefs and practices. This can be a very good thing for the church. When these challenges come, we must turn to the Scriptures. These debates followed with prayer and led by the Holy Spirit will guide us as well.
5. Difficulties entered the Church to help shape it into what God intended and, without it, the Church could not be what it is today. Difficulties also come into our own lives personally to help us become what God intends. Read 1 Peter 4:12 and James 1:2-4. How does understanding how God works in history help you to understand how God works in your own personal life?
Certainly as I have faced challenges in my personal life, those challenges and my responses to them have helped to shape me into who I am. Sometimes we fail, sometimes we make it, but God is always working in our lives. I pray that He will always use my life for His good and not my own. This is a difficult prayer and one that is hard to commit to. However, God wants all of us and I need to give him all of me.
March 17th, 2008 at 11:20 am
1. How important do you believe the Doctrine of the Trinity is for Christianity?
I believe it is certainly an important doctrine, it is a doctrine that the early church had to deal with and was certainly a significant issue for the early church. That leads me to believe that this is a big issue. Over time, this doctrine has become more and more developed and refined. This gives us a greater understanding and articulation of this remarkable concept. Nonetheless, a person’s view on the Trinity is key to orthodoxy within Christianity.
2. Why do you think that the Doctrine of the Trinity has been a test for orthodoxy since the beginning of Christianity?
Well, I believe the most important reason that it has stood the test for orthodoxy is that it is Biblical. The Bible is our guide for our life and faith. Although the Trinity is not a term used in the Bible, it is an explanation of the concept being presented consistently in the Scriptures.
3. A person once said that the existence of the Doctrine of the Trinity is proof that Christianity is not human in origin, since no man would ever come up with something so confusing? How is this true?
Well, the concept of the Trinity is certainly a mind-blowing concept. It is an amazing reality. I do not know if the Trinity can completely explain the concept. In the later pages of our workbook chapter on the subject, many analogies were put forward to explain how God can be one and in three persons. Although some of the analogies are helpful, they ultimately fail at some point. It just goes to prove how much greater our infinte God is compared to our finite minds.
4. Most of the Trinitarian heresies that came about through the history of the Church came from well meaning Christians who were doing their best to understand a difficult concept. Discuss how God uses heresy to shape orthodoxy.
Challenges to our faith ultimatley have caused the church to respond. These challenges make the church think about our faith, think about our beliefs and practices. This can be a very good thing for the church. When these challenges come, we must turn to the Scriptures. These debates followed with prayer and led by the Holy Spirit will guide us as well.
5. Difficulties entered the Church to help shape it into what God intended and, without it, the Church could not be what it is today. Difficulties also come into our own lives personally to help us become what God intends. Read 1 Peter 4:12 and James 1:2-4. How does understanding how God works in history help you to understand how God works in your own personal life?
Certainly as I have faced challenges in my personal life, those challenges and my responses to them have helped to shape me into who I am. Sometimes we fail, sometimes we make it, but God is always working in our lives. I pray that He will always use my life for His good and not my own. This is a difficult prayer and one that is hard to commit to. However, God wants all of us and I need to give him all of me.
6. Of the Trinitarian heresies discussed in this lesson, which one do you have the tendency to unwittingly embrace to some degree? Explain.
I really do not think I have one that I fall into or go along with. Perhaps I have tendencies toward modalism, but I am quite conscious of the different persons of the God-head. The concept of the Trinity is hard to comprehend. It is something I can not completely understand and attempts to understand it in the past have also fallen short.
7. How was your thinking challenged the most by this lesson? Explain.
The Trinity’s historical development is quite interesting. I think it is something I have taken for granted. I did not understand the development of this doctrine, how long it took, and the different heresies that were developed. Its an important history to understand so that we can better appreciate and study this subject.
April 9th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
Group Discussion Question #7
1. How important do you believe the Doctrine of the Trinity is for Christianity?
The Doctrine of the Trinity is essential to the gospel message. Without it Christianity would no longer be Christianity. Jesus Christ was sent to earth, died, and rose for out benefit, He is God. Without His deity, Christianity would have no basis.
2. Why do you think that the Doctrine of the Trinity has been a test for orthodoxy since the beginning of Christianity?
Without the Doctrine of the Trinity, Christianity would not exist. Christ is either divine or He is not, He is one in the trinity or He is not. Orthodoxy requires Christ being a full member with God the Father and God the Holy Spirit. Change this full state and exit orthodoxy.
Why do you think so many cults deny the Doctrine of the Trinity?
Many cults misunderstand the nature of the One God, Three Persons concept. They cannot get a grasp on the idea of the trinity thus the result is believing in three gods.
Human understanding, the definition of words, and the need for a nice easily understood package sends many in the direction of the unorthodox.
3. A person once said that the existence of the Doctrine of the Trinity is proof that Christianity is not human in origin, since no man would ever come up with
something so confusing. How is this true?
Tertullian affirmed that the doctrine of the Trinity must be divinely revealed, not humanly constructed. It is so absurd from a human standpoint that no one would have invented it. The doctrine is not self-evident and is not logically cogent. We believe it because God revealed what He is like. So, the Doctrine is a God thing, not a human one.
4. Most of the Trinitarian heresies that came about through the history of the Church came from well meaning Christians who were doing their best to understand a difficult concept. Discuss how God uses heresy to shape orthodoxy.
Heresy came to mean a separation or split resulting from a false faith. A separation of ideas so strong that it was possible to destroy the unity of the Christian church. Orthodoxy was present from the earliest beginnings of the church and was very early bombarded with ideas contrary to the early traditional interpretations of Scripture. Early Theologians by necessity had to defend orthodox doctrines of the Church. Christians very salvation was at stake. Each defense more clearly explained and improved the traditional understanding of the doctrines.
5. Difficulties entered the Church to help shape it into what God intended and, without it, the Church could not be what it is today. Difficulties also come into our own lives personally to help us to become what God intends. Read 1 Pet. 4:12 and Jas. 1:2–4. How does understanding how God works in history help you to understand how God works in your own personal life?
For several years now, I have been driven to seek more information concerning my Faith. There have been challenges as I have worked through this growth process, a delving into, accepting and rejecting of past and current ideas. I know this weeding process has caused growth in my Christian walk as it has to the many people who have walked before me. This process seems to be necessary whether on a personal or church wide scale.
6. Of the Trinitarian heresies discussed in this lesson, which one do you have the tendency to unwittingly embrace to some degree? Explain.
In a prior time, I believed in adoptionalism. Jesus the man was chosen to receive The Christ. I thank my God that He saw fit to protect me and give me direction into the correct Doctrine of the Trinity.
7. How was your thinking challenged the most by this lesson? Explain.
To come to terms with my own past and confirm my desire to know the Truth of God more fully.